Tag: Anonymous

What do you think Dammek’s obsession with making Xefros a butler is about? It would seem to me if Dammek wants to overthrow the hemospectrum, he wouldn’t be emulating an unequal class structure. I’ve read the theory that he’s secretly a highblood and is a double agent, but that seems unconvincing to me. Could it be because he wants to infiltrate a highblood place by pretending to be butlers? Any thoughts?

I don’t buy the double agent/highblood thing at all, it’s effectively random as far as I can tell. 

Dammek isn’t particularly trying to make Xefros a butler, though. Alternia does just fine at that on pain of death. 

What I DO think Dammek is guilty of is having Xefros serve him, specifically. But the exact way that’s fucked up seems a bit more nuanced, because Xefros describes his servitude to Dammek as Butler PRACTICE, and not getting enough practice is, again, literally lethal to Xefros if he isn’t good enough.
So I can see how both Xefros and Dammek might justify the treatment, though my guess is Dammek is probably too self-centered to think it through like that and most likely just sort of takes it for granted. 

Homestuck is extremely concerned with broad systems of power and how they affect individuals–even those who hate or try to fight the system. I think the reason why so many fans get hung up on issues of “Is Dammek good/evil” as if that’s a question that matters are sort of missing the point, which is that Alternia by design breaks kid’s abilities to have healthy relationships with each other. In this case, Dammek’s slight blood advantage is all it takes. 

question, I’ve heard you mention how the alt. calliope timeline was the result of John’s retconning, but i don’t see how that could happen. I’m just curious on your thoughts on it

Aranea says as much on this page:

John getting the retcon powers and making [S] Game Over “Unhappen” certainly qualifies as an improbable glitch in causality. It’s essentially the same as a controllable Scratch, it’s just that John is doing it himself.

More to the point, no other source is given for Alt!Calliope’s existence in the comic. So occam’s razor suggests this is the understanding the comic wants us to have. 

A. Claire doesn’t even have to be the same age as jane and jake if she’s a clone of jane, she could have been cloned years after, maybe even after jane finally ditched the condesce. this would make sense, since by 1980, jane and jake would be in their 60s/70s and jane (and any clone who was her same age) would be too old to have kids since most women go through menopause in their 40s/50s. it would actually make more sense for a claire to be a bit younger because of that actually

Nice, I like this. 

oh, drat. i was afraid youd say that you hadnt found anything for princes and bards. thats ok tho! ngl, the unifying myths are very useful when it comes to understanding a class AND the roleplay system concept! having them be finished would be nice, if it was possible. its probably not tho. an idea before i go- could it be the shakesperean fool? a comedic character that serves as an insight into complex issues, sometimes harsh, and usually isnt an idiot? i dunno. keep up the good work tho!

Actually the wake of that ask spawned a conversation that made me pretty conclusively decide that the unifying myth for Princes/Bards is probably Royalty, or Nobility, which is hilarious. That also makes me much more inclined to regard Thief/Rogue as Pirates or Outlaws in general. Sooo so much for my prior position–see what I mean? There’s always stuff in Homestuck that I’m missing, and my stance changes on a dime once I’m presented with a consistent strand of thought. 

Presenting it is going to require me to dive deep into the comic for quotes to be sure about it. I guess I’ll have to make some small meta posts or edit Force & Flow and see if they hold up! Couple other things to do first, though. I guess Stay Tuned™???

That post is so good!!! I can see someone who wrote for hiveswap reading that and being shocked by your accuracy. My only thing is, wouldn’t Pa who grew up with a Jane find it kinda incestuous to marry and procreate with another Jane? (I know they’re not related but I imagine the adoptive relation would be enough to gross someone out. Unless you’re postulating that A. Claire is very very different from Jane?)

A.Claire would be a completely different person than Jane, since she’s shaped by totally different experiences and Jane, as a Maid of Life, is uniquely defined BY her life experiences–I’ve written about my interpretation of Jane in this regard here. 

If this were true, then it would be Homestuck’s most ambitious and intense exploration of the questions of Nature vs. Nurture it’s explored continually so far, maybe even moreso than the difference between Bro and Dirk. 

That’s another reason I like the idea, given that the Alpha session is, in its broad strokes, heavily crafted by the extreme impact of either Dirk or Jane, who trade off absolute control of the session back and forth, but through proxies. AR (NOT Dirk) is in complete control of the narrative Pre-Entry, and Post-Entry Jane ends up dominating the whole session first through Trickster Mode and then through Crockertier–both times without her full agency. I only point this out to note that Dirk and Jane have always existed as extreme parallels of one another. 

So just as Bro seems to be influenced by Lil Cal to a great degree, I’d be interested in seeing a version of Jane who is fully subject to the Heiress role the Empress has always wanted to impose onto Jane, and which proved incredibly toxic to her in her Alpha timeline. Let me be clear: I think A.Claire is an absolutely heroic figure. I also think that about Grandpa, though–I just regard him as a hero with a tragic flaw, in the greek sense. 

I wouldn’t be shocked if A.Claire had a similar issue she never overcame, since that’s kind of the Thing with the Alphas, and though Jake and Jane undoubtedly love each other I don’t think they worked out their issues. If they had, I don’t think Roxy would have been so lacking for support, and if Jake had solved his problems through his relationship with A.Claire, I kind of doubt he’d have run away from the kids. 

But I digress. I don’t think Pa would find it incestuous because, for one thing, there’s no indication he would know. Pa was apparently a big fan of A.Claire’s. That’s unsurprising, given his at least subconcious affinity for his old friends. But he’d have no way to know about that or ask her about it before they actually became close. So basically I don’t think it’s something that would occur to him? 

so, let me tell you- the moment i started reading your force and flow esseys things started clicking into place for me. i, for one, wasnt a big fan of the widely accepted active-passive scale, and seeing it reworked into a literal scale was what really sparked the ol grey matter! same with the page-knight swap and the serve verb. you compile very well! anyhow, i wanted to ask a question. i know the “destroy” and “steal” sets are already defined- but are there any unifying myths for them you see?

Sort of, loosely, but nothing concrete enough that I feel comfortable presenting it. Thieves and Rogues SEEM to both be linked to the idea of a Pirate or Piracy–The serkets are obvious, but Roxy makes a couple references to internet piracy. As for Prince/Bard…I honestly got nothing. They’re maybe all loosely linked to puppets? They’re all called assholes? Maybe they’re loosely linked to royalty by way of Hussie’s prior adventure, Bard Quest?

I entertain a lot of wild ideas when I’m looking for a new angle on the story, but I don’t actually argue the points unless I have pretty strong evidence drawn directly from the comic–and preferably more than one example for something like this. I was originally not going to present Witch/Heir as ‘Magicians’ early in writing that series for example. I remember being frustrated because according to the trend I was detecting there should have been textual references to magicians or wizardry in the text for Heirs (Witches being the more explicit and literal reference to the myth, which is a running theme as well. A Knight is a straightfoward warrior, a Sylph is a kind of Fairy, a Seer is commonly understood as a Prophet, etc.)

but I couldn’t seem to find them, to the point that I gave up on including that section entirely! Aaaand then I came across the references to WV as a familiar and then found that post by the person who just OUTLINED John as a wizard for me. But my point is I put these points through a lot of scrutiny before I decide to present them, so while I have some loose ideas, my current opinion is that since the Steal and Destroy sets were freebies from the canon, they don’t have unifying myths as such.

Unless, of course, I or someone finds compelling evidence to the contrary in the comic. Which is a possibility I can’t discard–again, it’s exactly what happened for Heirs.

PS: oh by the way thanks a lot! I’m glad you got something out of them 🙂 

Have you considered “Vassal” as an alternative to the slightly awkward butler/warrior combo? It manages to convey a broader meaning of servitude than servant, and manages to keep with the 1 word nature of the rest

It sounds awesome, for sure–I’ve been fond of the word vassal since my disgaea days for some reason. I don’t see myself as coming up with this stuff, though–I just go off what I see referenced in Homestuck over and over. But that is definitely a term I hadn’t thought to search in the comic before just now–i’ll do some ctrl+f runs soon and see what pops up. 

What are some of the other literary classics and films that you think would fit with Homestucks referential style that weren’t used in the story? One that came to mind for me was Frankenstein.

the great thing about homestuck’s narrative structure is that it builds out from the characters’ interests, thoughts, and personal aesthetics, so theres basically no work of fiction excluded from potential inclusion in the format. like yeah i can definitely see all sorts of characters incorporating the motifs of Frankenstein into a classpect’s narrative (Prince of Life or Sylph of Doom for starters?), or just factoring into a characters personal style and aesthetic–like Jake’s genderbending emulation of action girls. 

But like it doesn’t have to be a literary classic or film or anything. Part of the power of this structure is that it allows one to be self-indulgent about incorporating ANYTHING they care about into an oc in whatever way they please. Canon fursona transformations? Sure why not. Giving your character an interest in digimon only to evolve that interest into an ACTUAL DIGIMON through classpect or sprite shenanigans? Whatever, why not! Want your character to unironically dress like a jrpg protagonist from the most decadent anime games? GO for it. 

And work whatevers interesting to you about those works’ themes, styles, powersets, etc. into your character if you like, too. the sky is the limit with Sburb’s setup, which could be exploited for personal self-expression way more. 

anyway catch me in my sburb session dressed like an utena character with my patamonsprite