anotherwitchofbreath replied to your post “anotherwitchofbreath replied to your post “Whuh oh you mentioned…”

omg, i seriously had no idea!! you even know way more than me about the series, which owns and im taking notes here. im really happy youve had the experience of playing that too. smt3 is a game i can never get out of my mind.

yeah its really something else. i usually dont talk about them cause im so busy with homestuck lately but theres a good number of other things i am as absolutely batshit about, and SMT is one of them. 

anotherwitchofbreath replied to your post “Whuh oh you mentioned Persona so I gotta ask: How much do you know…”

P3P is the only non homophobic persona. the only game that explores gnostic themes deeply in all of the series is not a persona, its shin megami tensei 3. its such a beautiful and moving take on it too. emulate that if you ever want to skip the bullshit and get to the real stuff, somehow the corporation wasnt able to screw that one up

so i should cop to being an immense Shin Megami Tensei nerd at this point, I guess? I’ve played Nocturne and I fucking love it, though I’ve never finished it.
I definitely think you’re right that it comes the closest to delivering on the franchise themes from what I have consumed of it, which is, a lot. Most of the game through various lps and cutscenes and stuff even for what i havent played.

though there’s a couple other SMT games I also think are good: 

Devil Survivor aims and lands mostly high even though it is AGAIN hamstrung by twee anime shit, I like SMT: Strange Journey a TON and it has Very Little of that garbage for the most part,

Persona 3 (Portable) is indeed probably the best persona for being non-homophobic though ironically it plays with LGBT themes a lot less than 4 (i have no idea how 5 does it other than i know theres no same sex romance options which, fuck that)

i could like seriously do a youtube series just about this franchise and probably will someday i love smt so much

This is only a small bit that I can contribute to your artfully constructed and likely extremely true theorypile… but, knowing that alt universe Alpha memories are a thing, the connection to the Cherub key makes sense symbollically, I feel, because Jane Crocker was the one Calliope entrusted with the red-green swirl lollipop juju–juju’s meaning being roughly adjacent to “heirloom”–setting a precedent for Jane as exclusively connected to especially Cherub-relevant Jujus among her peers.

Very true. Jane’s receival of the lollipop is even couched in her relationship to the Batterwitch, going by this log:

Makes sense another Jane would receive a similar inheritance. 

anotherwitchofbreath:

ok so i REALLY dont wanna involve myself in fruitless direct argumentation here but id like to maybe nip this mentality in the bud for anyone who has already seen arguments to this effect.

so mspa and homestuck were, for a long time, the projects of one guy with like, a tip jar, some limited merch and other sources of income to rely upon. to even reach the scope of what “homestuck the work” is pre-epilogue, hussie had to go full time with the project, find people to contribute to the comic, expand its scope, pay astronomical monthly hosting costs, travel to events, expand merchandising so as to pay for all this, etc. and even still it took years and years to get up to this point.

in this era, artists who create truly expansive works are taking on an unimaginable amount of financial risk, for themselves AND for anyone who they bring onto their team. there’s no socialist art patronage via the state, theres no guaranteed housing, income, healthcare etc that allows one to work at art without worrying for personal or familial survival. since our world is very much a bleak capitalist hell, even choosing pursuit of art means taking ones survival into ones own hands.

do i know corporations have suspect motives? hell yes i do, they literally are defined by a sole existential commitment to profit seeking and expansion, which overrides any other consideration individuals in the corporation might have. do i know that corporations that patronize art can become very meddlesome? absolutely. but without a stabilizing financial basis that corporate patronage provides, there was never going to be more homestuck to begin with.

homestuck is a historically unique work, an incredible one at that, but its appeal is somewhat niche, and the costs of even keeping it alive, let alone continuing it, have been very daunting. hussie’s decision is, ultimately, i think, very wise if survival of this saga is to be ensured. it is up to hussie and the WP crew to struggle for the independence of their work within the context of a new source of patronage, but yknow what? ive got a funny feeling like they’ll succeed in that struggle if they have enthusiastic enough fans supporting their work, to demonstrate that the homestuck saga, in its unaltered form, is populae enough to benefit viz.

so, let the works stand for themselves. for the love of god, dont decide that you think that homestuck is “too corporate” now because it has a strong financial backer instead of always being in a state of uneasy existential risk. because if you make a prior judgment and move to other stories, what are you going to do? are you going to make sure you dont touch any other corporate properties? because i hate to say it, but narrative media is pretty well under the corporate thumb nowadays!! is there nothing published by another company that you like? do you see anything that isnt independent of corporate influence and say, “this is superwholock to me”?

capitalism and the corporate structuring of industry, media, services etc need to be done away with. maybe some day the arts will be fully emancipated from capitalist control and truly belong to the people once more. but that is a huge, protracted struggle that will require massive coordination–a heavily individualized aversion to consuming anything tainted by the corporate is not a significant part of that struggle.

in the meantime, ill keep believing in the people who made the best artistic work ive ever seen, and be glad that their survival has been guaranteed for that much longer with thos latest move.

this take also kind of presumes that Viz has no interest in innovating in their approach to media, which is unlikely given they knew and appreciated what Homestuck even was in the first place. That can’t be said for, say, Marvel and DC. 

Snzzz muh what a boring cynical take. Please be less lazy about criticism guys it’s getting really boring to read. We literally know NOTHING about what’s coming and theres plenty of ways WP’s experience in media innovation could be an influence on the way Viz distributes content. This is unprecedented and exciting stuff. 

Post series on this very subject forthcoming in about an hour btw.

I’m curious about how this works… I mean, do we write it all off? Are all the romances merely fanservice towards a facade, or is this a real situation crafted by Caliborn? It would like… really *sting* if stories about Gay Romance With Positive Outcomes were themselves part of some huge ruse. I don’t think that necessary follows from the theory, but I don’t want that to be the case…

This represents pretty much exactly my train of thought, honestly. 

All I can say is I don’t think that’s the case–I think what we’re dealing with here is more complicated. But essentially right now we just have to wait and see how the comic handles the rest of it! 

By the way, I saw your comment about Jane RE: Mind control, and I will probably provide my thoughts on that whenever I (as soon as possible) write about Jane. I feel I have a decent amount to say there–just not anything that relates to Jake’s actions, so if you dont see that there that will be why