Seeking truth through conversations on Love and Fandom
Tag: My MSPA Analysis
Here’s to the start of a new series! Hiveswap Lore will run concurrently with Homestuck: Explained, and will be aimed at covering various parts of Hiveswap’s deep story that you might not glean from one or two playthroughs.
We start by covering Xefros Tritoh, as we explore how he affects others, and how the roles forced onto him by Alternian society affects his state of mind!
Full disclosure: This is a reading I’ve developed through my own research, so I could well be getting some things wrong! If anything I say here is disproven, I’ll definitely raise the subject again in future videos. We’ll be talking about Xefros’ (and others) Classpects again as more Acts come out regardless.
In this episode, we cover the mechanics behind each Sburb player’s individualized planet, the Lands. We explore the nature of their Consorts, and dive deep into the story-spanning importance of the Denizens as both game mechanics and mythological symbols.
Don’t worry if this one’s a little overwhelming! I’m still learning how to talk about this stuff, and I’ll definitely be covering the same material in different ways over time. Next episode will have us looking over Xefros’ complex and interesting Classpect. Thanks for watching, and please feel free to leave your thoughts!
I may as well throw in Dammek and the rest of these new trolls, too, since it’ll set a precedent for how I want to evaluate this class stuff as the games tell us more. I think Roleplay’s biggest advantage is that it’s pretty falsifiable, though you gotta be careful to get access to all the potential information possible before making a decision–I’m often caught off guard by the way this stuff lines up.
Since I’m not interested in getting the fandom SUPER EXCITED for classpects or lore in general in ways that lead to disappointment with the way the story develops later on, it’s REALLY important to me that A) roleplay as an idea gets held up to scrutiny and B) that I don’t try to overreach what I can derive from the information we’re given.
So talking about my own mental process for evaluating Class, I think, can only be helpful for both. I’m gonna do this in more depth in video form soon (so much to say about Xefros), but since you’re asking here’s a rough roundup. This got long so its under the cut.
I only have guesses as to a few of the trolls’ classes, because we just have too little information on them. I was able to guess Xefros would be linked to the Serve classes, probably Knight, only because he happened to be noted as being interested in Butlers.
Even then, I wasn’t guessing his actual class. It was implied pre-release that Xefros was a butler unwillingly, so I figured he was most likely being forced into Knight roleplay. Knights being the butlers associated with serving to benefit others–in this case, the Empire, though a lot of his service ended up being directed at Dammek as well.
That was all I figured. It didn’t account for his Page nature at all, and since I wasn’t thinking about Aspects as something that could be roleplayed, I took his Time thinking at face value, though there’s plenty of references to his relationship with Rage in Act 1.
Now that said, I don’t have a clue about Trizza’s true class, honestly. There’s so many ways her character could shake out that there’s no way to tell before getting to know her more. I’m going to guess that she might well be “roleplaying” the Life aspect, if there’s any merit to the Caste Influece/Aspect roleplay idea.
If that’s the case, she’s probably being at least strongly encouraged to roleplay either a Destroyer class–if the narrative emphasis is on her adopting Alternia’s hemospectrum superiority to heart and considering herself biologically superior by dint of aristocracy.
I like this idea, because it would relate the two Crocker heiresses who are actually forced to live under the Condesce’s thumb. And because if A. Claire is Jane, then the contrast between Anna as Heiress and Trizza as Heiress would be narratively interesting.
I also think it’s the slightly likelier option, because Xefros is already referring to her as the Heiress, meaning she hasn’t abdicated/abandoned the throne like Meenah and Feferi did.
It seems to me Dammek is likely a Thief. He’s got the outlaw imagery going on, and Xefros mentions Dammek “taking his stuff.” Dammek is also forced into Butlering, just like Xefros, and being a Thief means that being put into a position of Serving for the benefit of Others is essentially counter to his very nature.
It’s worth noting that while Dammek is demonstrably a Blood player–he’s able to steal from Xefros because of Xefros’ feelings for him, essentially, making it theft through Blood–the most notable object Dammek steals is the Hoverpad, which is a Breath item. It links to motion, flight and freedom, but also it’s laser is literally Breath blue.
So like Xefros, Dammek seems to be simultaneously manifesting his true Aspect, while also manifesting his Blood Castes’ Aspect, usually while linked with unhealthy or toxic behavior. The microphone can be interpreted as Dammek’s warped attempt to Serve Xefros Breath, for example, and theres grounds to read him as roleplaying a Knight at the time being, much like Xefros.
I treat these new trolls the same way. If there’s a suggestion of one of the archetypes in their design or text bites, I think there’s a chance they’ll be linked to the corresponding classes, either because it’s their true class or, maybe more likely, because they’re roleplaying.
I’m currently thinking there’s a chance almost every blood caste is encouraged to roleplay a particular role, so I’m keeping an eye out for that, but I’m not convinced. The strongest point of evidence would be the Olivebloods so far all qualifying as Outlaws, so I assume they’re all roughly roleplaying Thieves or Rogues.
That’s about all I’ve personally got right now. I’m curious about the troll call trolls, but there’s not a ton to say about each of them individually other than some idle speculation. I’ll be interested to see to what extent, if any, I’m right about any of them.
I’m not sure any of these will be the case because I’m still not 100% how much I’m full of shit about the way Roleplay seems to work, but that we’re being presented with so many trolls presents a very interesting case study.
Happy New Years, peeps!
In this section of our exploration of the Hero Titles, we discuss the Archetypes each pair of classes is based on. To be clear: This writing is based mostly on my own exploration of the comic! We don’t know for sure whether these play into how the Classes are structured on any official level.
However, I hope it proves a good starting point for understanding the Classes, and getting a sense for how flexible and evocative the Hero Titles are. Let me know if it does!
This question hits upon a lot of nuances that I’m not sure about myself, so I want to be clear that I don’t have this system figured out by any means. I think it’s consistent enough now that it’s worth talking about, just because there’s so many cases built up, but I don’t understand everything about how it works and I don’t want anyone to regard me as being particularly In The Know, here.
I’m figuring this out as I go along with everyone! And tons of times stuff that other people say sets off a cascade of new startling revelations. This is at least a weekly occurence lately.
So first up, as to Jade:
It’s a possibility that Grimbark is just a joke/parody, so it’s hard to tell if this is just a joke/comment and she’s really only acting like a Witch. Which means I’m not sure, but if she’s roleplaying at all, I’d say her acting like a thief might be a solid bet. It’d mean she’s acting More Active than usual, which does line up with her behavior.
Gotta stress though: I don’t really know if this is a case where roleplay applies. Rose got way longer, so she’s under the cut.
As for Rose, I’d say: In my view, not exactly, with the caveat that I’m honestly not sure here either?
I think Rose is roleplaying as a Witch, and I think she’s doing so partly because she imagines her mom as a Witch (Rose’s inability to really understand Mom is a key part of their conflict, after all). But there’s two important nuances I’d like to clear up:
1) It’s important to understand that Rose trying to be a Witch doesn’t mean she’s not being a Seer! It’s easiest to understand Roleplay as the characters adding Verbs/Archetypal symbols to their behaviors, with their true classes as intrinsic verbs they can’t change.
So Vriska can try to Make stuff and gets associated with Fairy-dom. She can discard that behavior, eventually. But she can’t discard her instincts to Steal/Take things, nor the associated outlaw/pirate imagery.
The same applies to Rose. She’s still a Prophet, and in many cases her Witch behavior acts in service to her prophetic behavior (using magic to tear the prophetic text she wrote into the Void, for example.).
And as she’s also behaving more like an Active class, this also makes her more like an active Prophet. Indeed, Rose is also referenced as a Mage at least once.
I’m not sure what parts of this are actual references and what parts are me reading too much into things, though. I’m just saying the symbolism surrounding this stuff can get muddled, and I’m not enormously sure where the lines get drawn.
2) I don’t think she’s roleplaying a Witch of Void specifically. I think the Void stuff surrounding Rose is likely a side effect–the more she commits to the Witch persona, the more her powers manifest “in defiance of her true Aspect”. And in Homestuck, powers manifesting that way generally tend to default to manifesting as the “opposing” Aspect.
In other words: Rose is just roleplaying a Witch, and aspect switching is what happens with any case of roleplay that’s unhealthy enough. Aspect “inversion” just seems to be the default, when that does occur.
At least, that’s the way I usually feel.
But because of Xefros, Dammek, and Joey, I don’t really think that’s
necessarily the rule. So maybe the Void part is also Roxy’s influence
after all???
It wouldn’t quite be unprecedented. Hal–A Prince of Heart’s– emulation of Dave–A Knight of Time– includes him trying to take over the temporal logistics. So maybe that’s the case after all.
What I will say is that in one respect, it’s crucial to understand Rose as both a Witch of Light and a Witch of Void.
A Witch always has a Familiar, intrinsically linked to their Aspect:
And how succesful they are at self-actualization is linked to how well they take control of their lives from their Familiar, which will protect them, but also try to control them. Jade has Becquerel, a Space Familiar. Feferi has Gl’bolyb, a Life familiar.
In Damara’s case, that Familiar is literally a Patriarch–Lord English, an embodiment of Time itself. And unhappy, miserable, isolated Damara decides she wants to serve him completely.
That’s why the Damara God Tier in the final army against him is such a
big deal, because it means a version of her succeeded in rebelling
against her familiar and asserting her true feelings.
Rose, then, has two Witch familiars, who work together to manipulate her. Her familiars of Void are the Horrorterrors, of course. Interesting that to Feferi, Gl’bolyb is just a fact of life, a reality she has to deal with. To Rose, the horrorterrors represent the absolutely unknowable and unimaginable.
Her Familiar of Light is Doc Scratch. It’s easy enough to say the Cueball represents omniscient knowledge, information, and so Light. But Scratch’s light coding goes quite a bit deeper.
He’s also Rose’s literal Patriarch, since being Dirk’s clone, he is technically her uncle. So yeah, I think Rose’s relationship to Scratch and the Horrorterrors is more visceral and understandable that way, and I wouldn’t want that nuance to be lost because we’re still reading her exclusively as a Witch of Void.
There’s actually a LOT MORE nuance to Scratch’s presentation than I’m expressing here,(surprise! Scratch is also roleplaying!) but this post has to end sometime. So that’s it for now.
Everyone can feel free to send me whatever insights they have one way or another on either point, I just can’t say I have all the answers. I think I’m onto something here, but if I am we’re more than likely gonna uncover most of it together.
Yin 陰 or 阴 Noun ① [philosophy] negative/passive/female principle in nature
Yang 陽 or 阳 Bound morpheme ① [Chinese philosophy] positive/active/male principle in nature
Homestuck inverts the polarities, making Passive classes Positive (+) and Active classes Negative (-) for mysterious reasons. Other than that, the connotations are identical.
Now, Homestuck’s imagery will sometimes fall into this Two-Color character conflict style, and it will serve as our guide for this section. Notice that PM, who is colored in White, is the Active (or Yang) party in this shot–she is preparing to attack Bec Noir. Bec Noir, who is colored in Black, is the Passive (or Yin) party–he is hesitant and uncertain, stunned into inaction by shock.
So we can roughly understand these color-contrast shots as follows:
If the character is colored in White, they are being Active. If the character is colored in Black, they are being Passive.
Now let’s apply this logic to the trolls as the chaos of Horrorstuck plays out, and see what it tells us when combined with the concept of Roleplay. Starting with this: The moment that Eridan kills Kanaya.
Things start off pretty simple here. Eridan, the Prince, is in White. Kanaya, the Sylph, is in Black. Prince is Active, Sylph is Passive, and as we all know, Eridan wins this round decisively, with a simple magic blast.
What’s more interesting is how we got here. Eridan seems to be roleplaying a Magician for this stint–in particular, a Witch, influenced by his interest in Rose and Jade and said to be a “highly Active” Class. He tells Jade he’s moved on from following Dualscar’s destiny, just before trying to get Feferi to betray the team.
Dualscar is a Bard–a Passive class. This means that relatively speaking, Eridan is playing to his strengths as an Active Destroyer more by channeling his energy into a more Active role, explaining his firepower buff. But is it really that easy for Eridan to leave his ancestor behind…?
Let’s come back to that question. Now let’s look at Gamzee, who for this stretch is living up to the image of the Grand High Blood–a Prince of Rage.
This section begins in earnest with Gamzee killing Equius, and–yup. There it is. Gamzee, the Active party, is in white. Equius, the Passive party, is in black. Equius submits to Gamzee’s will, and dies at his hands.
Gamzee is terrifically effective at roleplaying the Grand Highblood–he goes on to set Terezi up to kill Vriska in a grisly re-enactment of Redglare and Mindfang’s showdown at the Grand Highblood’s order. But this rampage comes at a personal cost.
Gamzee is incredibly unstable during this period, with the whole loud honking and red eyes thing. Insofar as we’re allowed into his head, Gamzee does not seem particularly comfortable or at ease in this role! It’s only once Karkat calms him down that he reverts to his more Passive role, and begins acting like his normal self again.
So we’ve got two instances of Active behavior linked to White, and Passive behavior linked to Black. We’ve also seen that roleplaying can explain how Gamzee changes from his traditional role of Passive destruction, to one of Active destruction–at a personal cost.
Now let’s look at an example that incorporates both Yin/Yang and Roleplay for both parties, in the conclusion of the 3x Showdown between Eridan, Vriska and Gamzee.
Of course, we’re actually interested in Kanaya, who turns out to dominate this fight utterly. Kanaya is one of the few highbloods who seems completely uninterested in roleplay. But then, in this context, maybe she doesn’t have to be.
Vriska suggests that a player’s destiny is tied to their Ancestors’, and while this definitely involves an element of “choosing to take on the life they left for you”, it also seems to have Karmic implications.
The Dolorosa, after all, is interwoven in the story of The Grand Highblood, Mindfang, and Dualscar–she becomes Mindfang’s slave, and is murdered by Dualscar.
Despite his claims to having moved on from Dualscar’s legacy, in this flash, Eridan is cast in his shadow. Meaning he’s being placed in the role of a Passive player, in the context of this sequence.
So Kanaya isn’t just getting revenge for Eridan’s crimes–there’s an implication she’s making up for Dualscar’s cruelty to her Ancestor, as well. Finishing what Dualscar started, so to speak. The Dolorosa being a Maid, we can understand Kanaya as roleplaying a Maid of Space.
And a Maid of Space is one who Makes Space…
For her own benefit. Bard is Passive is Black. Maid is Active is White.
A couple side notes:
1) Kanaya, like Gamzee, seems pretty drained after her spurt of intense Active behavior. Roleplaying as a more Active class can be effective in the short term, but it also seems pretty exhausting, as a general rule of thumb.
2) Given that Kanaya is revived as a Rainbow Drinker–a creature of fantasy–and that she glows pure Hope-White, we could even read Eridan here as inviting his own destruction through Hope. Just one of those little things I find so satisfying with Homestuck.
3) Relating Kanaya with the Dolorosa like this gives us some extra nuance with which to understand Vriska’s flash of red feelings for her. She related to Eridan and Tavros primarily in the terms set by their ancestors, after all–small wonder she’d find Kanaya more exciting as she completed her own Ancestor’s work, as well.
I found this pretty exciting once it came together for me, so I hope it does for you too. Let me know what you think! That’s all for now.
The basic idea behind Roleplay is this: Whatever a character’s Class, if they strongly admire or want to emulate a figure with a different Class, they’ll adopt said Class’ symbolic imagery and key verb behavior. This will pretty much always go poorly, since the player in question is focused on being someone else instead of being themselves.
Not much to add there, except to note that her Fairy God Troll behavior towards John (behavior that only Kanaya, a Sylph, shares while also succeeding in what she accomplishes) also leads to her Making/Creating Bec Noir.
But let’s talk about someone who isn’t very interested in Roleplay at all: Tavros Nitram.
Vriska tells us that the common bloods are less likely to value historical legends and Alternian traditions, and that actually seems to reflect in the story mechanically.
Eridan, Gamzee, Equius, Vriska, Terezi–all of these characters roleplay very heavily, and sit relatively high on the spectrum while sharing a passion for FLARP and/or historical systems of power, like the Hemospectrum or the Subjugglators.
Aradia, Karkat, Sollux, Tavros–all of these characters don’t really have much of an interest in their Ancestral Legacies. Tavros comes the closest, but it’s important to remember that his Rufioh is not the Summoner! He’s just a guy Tavros made up in his head or got from the Pupa Pan movie, not Rufioh himself.
Vriska’s the one who read Mindfang’s Journal, and so she’s the one who relates Tavros to the Summoner, who is a Rogue of Breath. And when she tries to make Tavros stronger, what she wants is to make him more like him.
Let’s take this to the critical point of Vriska’s investment in Tavros, and focus on Tavros for once. One thing people don’t tend to notice is that his Aspect powers nearly came to light as he prepared to kiss Vriska–or, in other words, to give her Breath. This was something he made a conscious choice to do, which I view as a critical part of his arc as a Page–the Active Serve/Give class.
If he’d succeeded, he’d presumably have learned how to control his powers better, and become a more effective member of the team by taking direct control of his power.
He does not succeed, as Vriska wants him to do things her way instead.
And her way, of course, is to attempt to have Tavros kill her to spare her an agonizing death. Put another way, Vriska wants Tavros to steal her life, for her benefit. This is behavior that would come naturally to a Rogue of Breath, but it does not come naturally to Tavros.
Notice that Tavros grows increasingly covered in Blood during this section, by the way.His freedom and personal momentum are utterly crushed under the weight of his relationship with Vriska, and the responsibility she thrusts on him.
Calliope tells us that if a character is “corrupted by an outside influence”, their abilities may manifest in ways “in defiance of their Aspect”. Funnily enough, through roleplay, we can in fact reach scenarios similar to those of Inversion Theory, since it is true that players who are roleplaying intensely sometimes take on connotations of their dichotomous Aspect.
This is a perfect example, since a Page and a Rogue are in fact entirely opposites in verbs and active/passive affinity. Tavros does not like behaving Passively, and does not find himself comfortable killing for Vriska’s benefit, or for that matter being told what to do.
And both of them suffer heavily for it as a result. Vriska dies a slow and painful death, and Tavros finds the whole event so traumatizing and exhausting that he basically withdraws completely for the rest of the session. That’s the kind of intensely negative effect that forcing roles on others can have in Homestuck.
So what happens when characters willingly take on roles that aren’t natural to them? And how much can this system be said to apply to most characters in the story?
Let’s try to answer both questions next time, when we explore the roleplay behaviors surrounding Eridan, Gamzee, and Kanaya during the height of Horrorstuck, and how Active/Passive alignment is communicated to the audience through visual symbolism.
It actually seems odd to me personally because in some cases the beta trolls we’re led to try and surpress who they really were and what they really wanted because of cultural expectations. (though you could say this has more to do with class roleplay than aspects in the case of just about everyone but karkat I think? Kinda?) also the trolls seemed made out (or stated) to be exceptions among their castes, some people think that’s important and relevant (I could stand to debate that) 2/2
I’m not sure what to say about the trolls being a cultural ideal thing. This is, again, not really about adulating the trolls themselves. The only thing that seems to claim a hold over the Castes is the sign’s Aspect. And I’m not particularly sure it’s about what society values on a cultural level. In a lot of ways, this stuff seems to show up as a kind of stereotyping. Xefros says indigos break cutlery, as if its something expected of the caste. There’s all sorts of statements about how society stereotypically views Rustbloods. So on.
That said, you hit the nail on the head. The Sburb trolls are all still immensely confused and acting against form–it’s just that almost all of them are doing so based on Class confusion, attempting to roleplay other classes without realizing what they’re doing and whatnot.
This presumed Aspect confusion, if correct, would be an additional layer of difficulty, that the Homestuck trolls were largely spared but everyone else on Alternia has to deal with to varying degrees. It would also be an evolution of the Classpect system, as far as our understanding of it goes.
I’m not sure what it means for the trolls to be exceptions among their castes, but if they’re uniquely powerful, that might have to do with them being handed a relative lucky break by not having their blood Caste steer them away from their natural Aspect alignment. If troll powers per Caste are linked to Aspect, but most members have different Aspect affinities, then suddenly it makes sense to some extent that one rustblood would have weaker psychic powers than another, and so on.
That said, maybe the most important thing to get across here is thatI’m not even particularly sure about this whole setup existing! Even if people do agree with me, I would really rather not come off like this is all DEFINITELY, FOR SURE, SUPER IN THE TEXT and have people get super married to the idea. I think it’s interesting and fun and want to foster excitement for Hiveswap where I can, but my approach to this stuff is always pretty tentative.
Xefros is a Rage player, yet thinks a lot about Time. Dammek is a Blood player, yet the main thing he steals from Xefros is a Hoverpad–an object of detachment, freedom, and literal Flight, who’s projected beam is literally Breath Blue. All this in the same game where Joey is being strongly linked to both Light and Life, simultaneously. Why are these double Aspect tendencies happening? Is there a logic to them, or are we just reading too much into it? And if there is a logic to them, what might it be?
At this point, the amount of confidence I invest in WP’s writing is such that I default to assuming that if I’m wrong, it’s because something better and more interesting is going on. So if I sound more willing to speculate than I used to be, it’s because I’m entirely comfortable with turning out to be incorrect about x or y thing. Wak’s theory is currently the best guess I’ve picked up on, so I’m running with it. But it could likely be wrong.
It’s even possible we ARE reading too much into the text, and WP just doesn’t want us thinking about Classpects in Act 1! Learning even that much would be useful in helping us figure out how to approach WP’s stories in the future. But Homestuck always lent itself to in-depth reading, and for now doing the same with Hiveswap feels meaningful and interesting. More importantly than that, it’s fun. So I think it’s worth doing.
But I don’t want my attempts to come to this venture with an air of fun and confidence to come off as me being certain, or proclaiming an Absolute Truth about the narrative. I’m raising questions here, not delivering answers.
Your English teacher was wrong, for starters. The presumption that all writers develop their work the same way is flat-out incorrect. I know writers who can only write with outlines, writers who don’t use outlines at all, writers who believe they’re writing out events that happened in some other place in the multiverse, and writers who strongly attest to just the opposite.
Depending on who you ask, writing is intellectual or personal or philosophical or spiritual or any combination of the above, and no two people approach it identically. Writing, like all art, is as personal an alchemy as the construction of your own identity.
So it’s entirely possible Hussie is a writer who could indeed have thought a lot of this out ahead of time. I don’t know the guy and am not in the habit of speculating as to his nature or allowing ideas about what’s “possible” for a writer to influence how I read the text, because usually what people think is “possible” is just a bunch of self-limiting bullshit.
That said, I don’t really know how Hussie wrote the story, beyond a few methods that are beginning to seem self-evident to me. We’re lucky in that one such method is one he’s discussed himself, presented here through @curlicuecal ‘s excellent roundup of Hussie’s quotes on writing:
The takeaway here is that Hussie is a very rules-focused author, who values consistency and strict adherence to the parameters he lays out. This is specifically about character writing, but Homestuck is a rules-focused narrative in all things, so it’s easy to extrapolate elsewhere:
The Alpha Timeline, Classpects, Roleplay, The Active/Passive Spectrum, Denizen symbolism, Dreamselves–all have corresponding sets of rules, whether they be guides for behaviors, logical consequences to actions taken, or the fundamental structures of the setting itself.
So I’d suggest that this hypothesis is somewhat likely: At least insofar as the Gnostic symbolism that pervades the entire story goes, you’re mixing up cause and effect.
Hussie didn’t need a second draft to “add” symbols to his story, because Homestuck is built around the symbols in the first place. It’s worth noting that Homestuck itself puts a massive emphasis on the power of Symbols through the TRAGICALLY overlooked Drunk Rose District section:
So, for example, Hussie didn’t need to know every minute twist and turn of Caliborn’s ridiculous story in order to build him up as a compelling villain–he just needed to start Homestuck’s story with the understanding that it was about being “Trapped” in a flawed world created by a “Yaldabaoth” figure: a flawed, evil Creator God associated with the Sun.
This means Hussie could use the symbol of the Sun to stand in as a symbol for Yaldabaoth/the central antagonist, which is precisely what we see him do:
And the details of the antagonist’s nature could be developed and presented later, linking the character to the Symbol explicitly in any number of ways:
Like the red sun being presented later in Caliborn’s artwork, “Homosuck”–represented by his red cheek spiral, no less.
The Demiurge is sometimes described as an Angel, and through association with Samael, specifically an Angel of Death. There we get LE embodying Death to Troll-kind, and Caliborn and Calliope’s Cherubic origins. So on and so forth.
This is the logic that guides my approach in researching everything Homestuck presents, not just Caliborn. The Classpects, the Denizens, particular character beats–everything. So far, I think it’s been pretty fruitful, so I might be onto something with all this.
And doing this kind of freeballing, primarily online research for mythbuilding would also make a lot of sense if Hussie were, for example, writing primarily for an online audience known for researching and analyzing pretty much everything the story presents.
It would in fact be quite efficient to include some references to Wikipedia and then litter the story with thematic and symbolic callouts, letting the fandom pick up the threads and apply them to the plot, which itself would benefit from being able to focus on itself without having to take the time to explain and break down every symbol and reference.
Again it’s worth saying that this is just me guessing based off what I’ve seen in Homestuck itself. I have no idea if Hussie actually approached the story at all like this. I could well be wrong.
But whether or not it’s true in Hussie’s specific case, it’s certainly a way one could plausibly construct a story like Homestuck, if one were inclined to write a very complex story with profound symbology and approached writing as a process of setting and then holding to a series of rules.
So whether or not it’s true here, I think it lends a certain logic to how stories like Homestuck could be written, and that makes it a valuable exercise in critical analysis and in considering how I might like to write things someday, myself.
Writing works like this is certainly not impossible. It just takes a little foresight, persistence and commitment to a certain work style, and good foundational design.
Well, it’s @rosemarymonth and I’ve wanted to talk about Rosemary and why I think the canon gets WAY too little credit with regards to their execution for ages so I may as well do it now.
Keep in mind, of course, that I am a dude and in no way want any wlw to feel I’m shutting down critiques of Homestuck’s flaws in this regard. I think that’s perfectly valid, this is just my reading. I’ll be interested in seeing what people have to say.
I don’t get to talk about Rosemary enough anyway, so I’ll also take you up on it and go over why I love Rosemary and why I think readings that they were “meant to be moirails” and “go ooc” is straight up just misreading the text, because the comic is actually pretty clear in broadcasting its intent.
The thing to keep in mind is that Homestuck’s entire plot follows one consistent rule: The message of AURYN from The Neverending Story, “Do what you will.”
The events in Homestuck that actually happen are by design the sum product of the wills of the entire cast, and how well characters express their wills on reality directly correlates to how “powerful” they are.
Caliborn is the villain because Lord English violates EVERYONE’s agency by confining them all to the plot of Homestuck/his Alpha Timeline. Within the confines of those prescribed paths, however, reality always defaults to fulfilling the wishes of all characters involved, or resolving the tension between them.
What this means PRACTICALLY is that almost every event that happens in the story, no matter how ridiculous….
is, on some level, foreshadowed by the desires of the characters, just as Arquius’ heroic sacrifice and absorption into LE is foreshadowed by the desires of both him and Caliborn:
Oh, and speaking about Caliborn wanting to be bros with Dirk and allowing him to die as if going to sleep:
All this in mind, let’s focus on Rose and Kanaya. No, I don’t get the impression they were ever going to be moirails. I’m not sure when Hussie decided on Rosemary, but I get the impression it was early, at least by the time Kanaya was introduced.
Why? Let’s take stock of both girls’ desires and conflicts throughout Act 5.
Kanaya’s early characterization revolved around A) A tendency to gravitate and pacify take-charge, forward individuals,
and B) A profound dissatisfaction with that role.
That’s what burned her out so hard when she was interested in Vriska. So I’m not sure why one would assume that actually, Kanaya’s True Destiny was to fall into… the exact same arrangement with Rose once again, despite expressly avoiding it. That doesn’t seem like good storytelling to me.
Especially since Rose is, from the very beginning, posited as an idealistic escape from that solitude for Kanaya. Kanaya is the receiver of Rose’s prophetic text—one of her earliest big contributions as a Seer of Light– and it makes a tremendous impact on her.
That impact is partly manifested as an out and out romantic fantasy about Rose, who Kanaya idealizes as the legendary leader of her session.
Kanaya’s fantasies about Rose in this regard play heavily into her attempted courtship through the Flighty Broads and their Snarky Horseshitometer sequence—and it is romantic courtship.
Kanaya makes that clear in the mission-critical text document where she positions herself as an antagonistic suitor to John, and that document is first referenced in… oh, mid-Act 4.
So Kanaya’s romantic interest suffuses the narrative from pretty early on. What about Rose?
Let’s talk about romance aesthetics. Pretty much every endgame ship in Homestuck is couched in a distinctive brand of romantic connotation. For example, Dave and Karkat are linked to anime romance cliches, with Dave as shonen hero and Karkat as heroine.
Jade and Davepeta are linked by a mutual indulgence in furry identity. Vriska and Terezi get the “Home Sweet Home” connotation of The Wizard of Oz, and Dirk and Jake have the undying devotion and mutual passion implied by their link to The Princess Bride.
Rose is once described as a reserved girl “enamored by what dwelt in shadow”. This is a facet of her characterization that’s present from moment 1, what with her interest in the Horrorterrors. Another obvious place to go is Mom, and by association Roxy–both of whom certainly “dwell in shadow” as Void players.
And then, of course, we have Kanaya:
Vampires are traditionally associated with hiding in darkness, away from the Light. And Kanaya describes her rainbow drinker fantasy in exactly those terms. So this aesthetic link between them is established pretty damn early, too.
Of course, Kanaya is not a traditional vampire. I’m far from the first to point out that Rainbow Drinkers most strongly resemble the hyper-romanticized, shine-in-the-light vampires of Twilight, one of the most popular romance series for teen girls of the 2000′s.
Taking that incredibly popular aesthetic and using it as a wrapper for the love story of two girls is instantly compelling. What’s genius is that this is a cocktail of imagery that has natural appeal for Roseas a person, because while it’s true that she’s interested in the darkness that surrounds her, it’s clear that Rose spends her narrative seeking the truth and the meaningful.
In other words, even when she’s enmeshed in darkness, what Rose wants is…
The Light. She may not have taken an interest in Meyer’s prose or Edward’s surly patriarchal authority, but all else being equal? Rose was all but made for a story with imagery like Twilight’s. That in and of itself would be evocative and romantic enough, but it goes deeper.
Because Rose’s relationship with Kanaya is deeply interwoven with her relationship to the reality of Homestuck, a conflict that Kanaya directly helps her solve. Perhaps fittingly, given that Kanaya is a Sylph implied to be “Made of Space”, and so innately linked to the Setting of the story through her Aspect.
This conflict between Rose and the Setting of Homestuck is, in my view, nothing less than the main thrust of Rose’s character arc, so it’ll take a little bit to unpack. Let’s dig in.
But even before she learns about him in name, she spends pretty much her entire arc resisting and fighting against his machinations, subtly perceiving something deeply wrong in the story from its very beginning.
In this, Rose strikes a compelling counterpoint to her partner TT, Dirk Strider. Because If Dirk’s character arc revolves around his belief that he himself is inherently evil, then it’s fair to say Rose’s main conflict is a belief that the world itself is inherently evil.
Or at the very least, incomprehensible and meaningless. Random and empty of logic or reason. And borderline antagonistic to her and her friends, as though reality itself is an unfortunate occurence.
In other words, Rose’s experience of reality is deeply colored byVoid, the aspect of the unimportant, meaningless, irrelevant, and most importantly: incomprehensible.
Just as Dave’s sense of self is broken by his abusive upbringing from a Prince of Heart, so too Rose’s sense of reality is shaped by her codependent relationship with her Mom, a guardian whose actions she can neither understand nor predict.
As a Seer of Light, Rose is drawn towards trying to understand the truth, and in particular the inner truths and meanings behind the minds of others. At the core of her being, Rose is a person who desperately desires to know and understand.
Consider how frustrating this must make Mom’s erratic and dysfunctional behavior to her–there’s no rhyme or reason behind her mother’s actions, influenced as they are by her depression, loneliness, and alcoholism. There’s just apparent randomness from the person who defines her entire life– in essence, the God of her household.
Add in Roxy’s tendency toward passive-aggressive behavior–which Rose definitely perceives from her Mom, whether it was intentionally directed at her or not–and it’s unsurprising that Rose quickly begins to view reality as not just nonsensical and arbitrary, but outright antagonistic.
Rose’s inherently defiant worldview is only intensified by Sburb. Not only does Mom continue being aloof and indecipherable, but Rose discovers that fate has apparently already decreed that she and her friends are doomed to failure and death. To Rose this is more than unacceptable: It’s infuriating.
Throughout Act 5, characters often comment on how Rose’s obsession with subverting Sburb leads her to becoming withdrawn, self-serious, and distant from her relationships. She also attempts to assume responsibility for herself and everyone around her, culminating in the suicide mission she tries to take on alone.
All of this is accompanied by her tearing her Land apart, as she foregoes its “childish” path in favor of something she perceives as more mature and adult. Most blatantly of all, Rose flirts with emulating her Mom in her most obviously adult activity: indulging alcohol. Rose is, in essence, trying to be an adult. Forcing herself to grow up too fast.
By the way? Withdrawing emotions, carefully managing the feelings of others, attempting to assume outsize responsibility for their households and attempting to take care of their guardians are all behavioral hallmarks of kids who grow up in codependent households.
Fast-forward to the aftermath of Cascade, when Rose achieves God Tier and comes face to face with Kanaya for the first time. It’s notable that achieving God Tier is the first moment that Rose is given any indication whatsoever that the plight she shared with her friends was not just random, pointless doom.
It is instead a lucky break. Or a suggestion of greater meaning. In essence, it’s the first time Rose is given really any reason to see reality as anything but the chaotic, nonsensical burden she’s experienced it as so far.
The revelation is accompanied by Kanaya’s sudden phosphorescence, which Rose describes as “inexplicable”–a word usually associated with frustration for her. Here, however, it comes as a happy surprise. Here, Rose is seeing through the incomprehensible Void of her reality to perceive Light for the first time.
Especially since the trend continues. As Rose grows more confident reality not necessarily ALWAYS being a hellish, meaningless landscape of random and pointless suffering, she also grows more playful and willing to be sincere. She grows to trust the Light she was once so suspicious of, asks Kanaya out on dates, and comments on things she enjoys about her without insincerity.
But she remains traumatized and conflicted about her relationship to both her Mom and the world, and takes up Mom’s alcoholism as a way to try to understand the former and ignore the latter.
This comes between her and Kanaya, since Kanaya relies on Rose to help her figure out HER role in the world, and to figure out how to achieve the revival of her species.
It’s worth mentioning that alcohol abuse, for both Rose and Roxy, is extremely Void-coded. It leads Rose to prioritize the pointless, ridiculous, unimportant and non-existent.
Here, Kanaya ends up valuing the desires of her physical form as a Rainbow Drinker over the more idealistic goal of the revival of her species, or even her relationship with Rose. As such, the two girls’ problems are marked as the same problem, even as they drive them further apart from one another.
And we see where their disunity and lack of direction takes them Pre-Retcon: It renders both of them less effective, and thus less important to the plot. It also leads them to misfortune. Rose’s inability to connect with and help, or even be helped by Kanaya, leads directly to tragedy in her relationship to the world.
Good thing there’s a flip side.
In the retcon timeline, Rose and Kanaya work stuff out. Rose gets past her alcohol addiction and directly credits Kanaya’s aid for it. Kanaya resists the pull of literal blood as she takes Karkat to Echidna and engages in an intellectual discussion about his relationship to his Aspect and the future of Troll-kind.
Rose reconciles with her Mom completely through Roxy, finding meaning where she could only speculate before. And with her increased ability to sort truth from lie, important from unimportant, and meaningful from irrelevant…
She resolves the tension between herself and the “demands” of Sburb, openly voicing her ambivalence to the very concept of her Personal Quest. In so doing, she illuminates an important truth to both the cast and the audience: that Sburb’s prescribed path to self-actualization is not particularly important, and certainly not strictly necessary.
Inner truth, understanding, good fortune, foresight, and happiness–Rose never needed to comply with some videogame’s 12-step program for self-satisfaction to get any of that, and neither do we. Light can arise anywhere, as long as you have the patience to look for it and people who love you at your side.
Hope this helps you see what I see, anon. Rose and Kanaya’s story is one worth cherishing, and I haven’t even come close to saying all I think there is to say about it, if you can believe that! But its a start.
Happy rosemary month, happy Halloween, and as always
Flying through Storytelling 