EPISODE 12: Talking about all things DIRK STRIDER with a new guest, our favourite Dirk expert, Arch!
Topics include Lil’ Hal, denizens, aspirational roleplay, queer isolation, and the morals of creating Lord English.
Y’all this episode was so good and im feeling about Dirk so much right now
Episode 12: The Unbearable Lightness of Being Dirk (with Arch)
Given how the denizens usually factor into the characters’ arcs in various ways, I’ve come to believe its possible to sorta reverse engineer at least some of the denizens of the characters we don’t know.
The ur-example here is Gamzee, who is so heavily linked to Dionysus I can’t really see another option for him.
Unless he has Yaldabaoth, which is possible since
A) Part of Dionysus’ mythology that links to Gamzee involves becoming one with Zeus, just as Gamzee becomes part of LE, and Homestuck’s mythology generally seems to treat Yaldabaoth as a symbol Zeus, Ra, and YHWH at once depending on the roles Caliborn/Dirk (rly Bro and AR here)/LE are playing at the time.
B) It seems at least possible that Yaldabaoth “replaces” the standard Denizen a player might have, yeah. (To be honest though, I’m not sure that Denizens are precisely aspect specific–my views on Denizens generally borrow a lot from @dahniwitchoflight, her conjecture on that particular system makes the most sense to me right now.)
C) Gamzee obviously qualifies for the “natural born warrior” thing. So does Equius, but due to Gamzee’s dominance I tend to assume he’s likelier to have Yaldabaoth.
Incidentally, if Equius doesn’t have Yaldabaoth, I’ve speculated he might have Orpheus, since Orpheus is at least in some places understood as a version of Dionysus, and Equius’ story seems to have some parallels to his.
Looking at canon this way it also becomes a solid guess that Terezi’s denizen was Themis, since again she’s blatantly enmeshed in her mythology.
That gives us at least one reasonably fitting denizen for Rage and Mind–Dionysus and Themis, respectively. As for Doom, I haven’t identified a particular mythological figure Sollux or Mituna seem based off other than the obvious–the Gemini twins, Castor and Pollux. But since there’s two there, I’m not sure how that’d translate to a Denizen–a dual denizen with two names would be fitting enough, I suppose. It’s also possible I’m missing some other mythological references built into the Captors, so who knows.
Don’t have anything to go off for Blood, though. Both Kankri and Karkat are fully enmeshed in Jesus imagery, all of which ties directly into Abraxas, so they don’t have any outside mythological ties to let us speculate into their Aspect’s “corresponding Denizen” specifically, if indeed such a thing exists. I’ve thought for a long time that YHWH would be a fitting match for Blood, as a “God of the covenant”. But that’s just my long-held fan preference, not any kind of serious speculation based on canon.
also totally forgot, wanted to make a note on something Vriska says about Echidna
VRISKA: Really, who knows what her real purposes are? They’re pro8a8ly totally unfathoma8le.
VRISKA: Echidna is kind of a 8ig Deal Denizen. One of the real heavy hitters, like that other guy… the really strong one with the ridiculous name.
VRISKA: She might even 8e the 8iggest deal. She’s the mother of all denizens. I mean, not in a literal sense. Like, I really dou8t she physically spawned them all.in greek myth Echidna is literally the mother of all monsters, but that bolded line there is referencing Yaldbaoth, a gnostic concept, not a greek myth
and i think this is interesting that this is the way that Hussie is deciding to mix Gnostic and Greek myths, he’s making Echidna the literal mother in both myths
he’s basically equating her with Sophia the aeon of wisdom from gnosticism that spawned Yaldabaoth and was responsible for his creation by emanating without her partner aeon (reproducing on her own without her spouse essentially) which is where we get our word Philosopher, meaning Lover of Wisdom, Philos Love and Sophia Wisdom
and thats really cool! i just wanted to say that lol that Homestuck’s Echidna can be thought of as more of a mix between the Greek Echidna and the Gnostic Sophia! adds a new angle onto how to view her 😀 and makes sense as she has always been a denizen in Homestuck that has all this wisdom to give and greater knowledge of all the sessions beyond and likely to be the essential key denizen when stuff goes down
Makes me start to question my thought that Calliope would get Abraxas as the other more truly powerful gnostic concept, if Hussie is adding a gnostic connection to Echidna, who is already the space player denizen then it’s a high candidate for a version of Calliope to have her as a denizen as well!
Caliborn as one half that was stunted in growth has Yaldabaoth the stunted god thrown out of heaven Lucifer analogue
The cherub that is the true merger of Calliope and Caliborn has the Abraxas, as the ultimate god merger of everything
and a Calliope would have Echidna, as the super strong mother space denizen with connections to Yaldabaoth directly made with the connection to Sophia as his mother
and I keep saying a Calliope because what I think is most likely is that Alt!Calliope is most connected to Homestuck Echidna which is better understood as Echidna/Sophia, powerful all knowing warrior mother goddess most in opposition to Yaldabaoth with the Sophia connections, while our Callie gets Abraxas, the true real one, what is meant to happen and the actual gnostic denizen who transcends both Echidna/Sophia and Yaldabaoth!
I love pretty much all of this-the link between Echidna and Sophia has never felt more explicit, especially with Alt-Calliope as a manifestation of the “Holy Ghost”.
though I disagree with our Calliope having Abraxas as opposed to Echidna. Part of this is that I think Jake and Karkat fill the role of Abraxas partly through their relationships to both cherubs.
But to me, Alpha Calliope seems like the truest version of Sophia we get in the story, and that makes all the difference. She’s the Sophia who tries to “know the unknowable” (Cherubs playing Sburb is an explicit taboo) and creates the Yaldabaoth of Homestuck: Lord English.
not just sometimes, that’s literally what he is and because he stands for all opposites, he isn’t stuck between effectiveness and ineffectivess, since ineffectiveness in it’s nature never manifests, it is literally *ineffective*,
It is things not happening, versus things happening, so something that doesnt happen has no power against the things that do happen, letting unbridled effectiveness unfold wherever it pleases. They are unique opposites that by nature do not cancel each other out.
This is what Abraxas is all about and why he is a god, the ultimate god guy person thing. he need only imagine something for it to become reality because as the culmination of all opposites, usually all opposites cancel each other out, so his power is nothing except effectiveness, since that’s the only thing that manifests in the face of its opposite
but yes since he is literally everything in one being, he is the most truly powerful (yalda only believes he is the biggest bad aruund because he is either ignorant of Abraxas’s existence, or is directly malevolent against him, depending on the tale, but homestucks yalda seems to be the ignorant one)
but this means that as a denizen in nature he is whatever the player can need him to be, representing them perfectly like how Karkat described for himself, but the thing that makes me think that its Abraxas the most is Karkat saying how he’s the opposite of Yalda, and Yaldabaoth and Abraxas are opposed as the fake ultimate and the true ultimate creator, everything Yaldabaoth does is just a sham imitation of what Abraxas is
Abraxas creates all things from himself and permeates all of a reality of like while the facets of himself manifest as varying aeons of a perfect reality
Yalda tries to imitate this by creating our material realm in which he permeates throughout and this is gnosticism’s explanation for why our realm is dark and imperfect in nature, a cheap shitty imitation, think how like Homosuck is to Homestuck
So Karkat saying the denizen opposite of Yaldabaoth, when usually you would assume that was Echidna, but he’s clearly meaning someone else, makes me think he means Abraxas. Those three Echidna, Yaldabaoth and Abraxas are closely tied together symbolically in homestuck, especially when you see the Echidna/Sophia parallels, they are the 3 denizens directly relating to gnosticism and to eachother, so when soeone mentions one while describing another, i tend to them of them 3, so it’s perfect as well that as Yaldabaoth is represented as all powerful and for the strongest players, Abraxas would be represented seemingly first as the opposite, for the ‘weakest’ players, but in reality he is truly the Denizen of the actual strongest players, even if they themselves do not see it yet
Perfect for someone like Karkat and Jake
just think of it like them being “Strong in the real way” yknow?
You’re not wrong, but I think part of what Homestuck’s arguing is that what we think of as “true evil” IS just lack of maturity, and Bro’s stoic machismo is simply one of the different explorations of this stunted lack of emotional growth and self-awareness.
Caliborn isn’t just arbitrarily an infinite evil asshole–he’s literally biologically incapable of growth. AR is the same way–frozen in time developmentally by his nature as AI. Both reflect an absolute domination that echoes Yaldabaoth, and both turn out to be mayor components of LE.
The difference between them is that AR becomes LE through heroic sacrifice, having transcended his innate limitations through connections to others by becoming one with Equius and wanting to serve his friends.
Caliborn stunts himself willingly, by making the selfish and childish choice to murder his sister and force his predomination early. This is what allows him to play Sburb alone.
But it also secures his downfall, because by killing Calliope rather than devouring her soul through predomination, he puts Calliope’s soul out in the furthest ring, thus ensuring he’d be out looking for her as LE and causing the events that end his rule in Homestuck.
(This is why there’s no Caliborn ghost corresponding to Alt!Calliope’s timeline–she predominated naturally, and devoured Caliborn’s soul/consumed his strength. This is also why we don’t just see AR/Equius/Gamzee’s souls out in the void after they become part of LE–Caliborn didn’t just kill them to take over, he predominated and made their souls part of him.)
Both are tragic heroes, in the true Greek tragedy sense. AR’s story is one of heroic but flawed transcendence out of inherently unjust circumstances that made him innately imperfect–a result of Dirk’s own childhood hubris and demiurgic act of creation. Caliborn’s hubris is his own, and it’s what allows him to both create and destroy himself and the entire reality of Homestuck.
Yaldabaoth has been assigned to Caliborn (Time) and Dirk (Heart). So we know he, at least, doesn’t necessarily link to Aspect. Not much reason to think Abraxas necessarily does, either.
And given that only two Beta trolls became part of LE, Yaldabaoth probably went to either Equius or Gamzee. Unless nobody got Yaldabaoth in that session, and Equius/Gamzee got Orpheus/Dionysus respectively? Don’t really know yet.
But the two of them are the closest to what I’d call “naturally gifted warriors” other than…Eridan? And Gamzee is the one who comes closest to “matching” Yaldabaoth’s thematic tropes. So nothing suggests either Yaldabaoth or Abraxas went to their “Aspect” partners there.
yuuup. One way to parse it is that Bro, like Yaldabaoth, is an agent of seemingly “thoughtless” action–all powerful over materiality but too blind to ideas/emotions to know what to do with that power.
Karkat, by contrast, exerts his power entirely THROUGH feeling and thought. His voice is his strength because he’s able to move and help people through it–much like Abraxas itself talked at length about every detail of Karkat’s own psyche to him.
Parallels!
CG: ABOUT GODDAMN BLOODY TIME, ISN’T IT?
TG: bro we’re like fuckin inscrutable by design, cut the dude some slack
Really excited to share this with you guys, I think it’s likely my best writing yet. Here we cover Dave and Karkat’s arcs, incorporating themes and beats from Hephaestus, Abraxas, Final Fantasy’s Cloud and Tidus, Naruto’s Sakura, Tsunderes in general, and the most important concept of all: Nakama.
Lemme know what you think! But also, I have a favor to ask.
If you like Davekat and this post moves you–please share it. Historically, I’ve had a pretty hard time getting my stuff circulating on Tumblr, for some reason. That’s usually not been a problem, since my Youtube audience has grown so fast. But Youtube’s been making some changes that have made my growth slow to a near stop recently, and that’s got me kinda scared tbh.
Because if I can’t grow my audience, it’s basically impossible to make this a genuine life-sustaining business for me. And the degree of effort and creative energy my content takes means I can’t really do it unless its a job, so I may not be able to continue doing this.
I doubt it will go that way and I’m not giving up til the bitter end, don’t get me wrong. But Youtube is by far my biggest platform, and the one with most potential-hence why big changes there are so scary. My only other hope for growth is here on Tumblr, and that hope only exists if people care enough to share what I’m saying. So I’m just lettin you know it’d help me out.
But no pressure!
Oh, and also, I need to give out some major props out to the writers who made this post possible:
Credit for the Dave|Tidus connection goes to Griever, author of @jojostuckcomic. Check out his fan adventure here, if you like Jojo’s Bizzare Adventure-it’s a really fun time!
And go check out everything @saccharinescorpion‘s ever made, too. Pheonix Flair is incredible and excellently lgbt, all of her short stories and games are amazing, her media analysis ranges from excellent to outright prophetic in this case, and she deserves the support.
Thanks for taking the time to read all this.
Keep rising.
Hephaestian Shonen; Abraxian Tsundere – optimisticDuelist – Medium
i kinda think the fact that dirk deliberately steered himself away from the legacy of Bro/Caliborn/LE is exactly why he never got to face Yaldabaoth in the first place. the more of a Denizen’s Choice a player embraces, the more they seem to fulfill said Denizen’s mythological arc.
The legacy of Yaldabaoth is quite literally the legacy of Lord English–the former is a symbol of the latter. But Alpha Dirk proper is charting his own destiny, apart from that doomed recursive loop. Yaldabaoth no longer has sway over his story.
I’m never inclined to think any character’s self-diminishing thoughts are correct.
Abraxas makes sense for duality stuff with Yaldabaoth–Yaldy is all about overwhelming power over the physical world, while Abraxas is all about complete embodiment of every aspect of the world of ideas.
Puts some meaningful context to Karkat’s description of his Denizen here:
Flying through Storytelling 